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| 苏丹红事件该谁来举证 |
| 2007-8-28 |
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苏丹红事件该谁来举证
食品污染事件、奥克斯车主维权事件、奥拓苯超标案……这些引起社会广泛关注的维权事件虽属于不同领域，却有一个共同特点：商品生产量大，涉及不确定的众多消费者，消费者因证据不足而举证困难。
群体维权中消费者举证难在何处？经营者应该负有什么责任？政府监管扮演什么角色？昨天，中消协第四场网上辩论会请来中国政法大学民商法学教授李显冬、华联律师事务所律师王惠娟、北京问中律师事务所李万华、北京凯锐律师事务所郭福良四位专家，就这些问题展开激烈辩论。
焦点一：消费者为何举证难？
正方经典语录：消费者维权证据不足造成维权困难，主要原因是我们国家现行的民事诉讼证据制度。谁主张谁举证的证据制度造成消费者出具证据困难。
正方观点（李显冬、王惠娟）：首先，吃了含有苏丹红、孔雀绿石绿的东西，不是像今天打了你，把你的腿打断了那样，损害后果的发生是滞后的，这是举证难的第一个原因。其次，根据现行的民事诉讼证据制度规定，谁主张谁举证。消费者在使用含有不符合国家标准有害人体的食品以后，如果想向厂家索赔，必须承担举证责任，首先要证明自己食用了危险食品，必须由对方提供。如果经营方没有主动提供，就造成消费者索赔的困难。此外，购买商品时消费者只从经营者处取得消费凭证，厂家并不直接向消费者提供销售产品的证据。
反方经典语录：什么是有害？多大程度、多长时间有害？这些概念的界定是技术问题。赔偿多少的额度也是技术问题。
反方观点（李万华）：我是奥克斯案子的经办律师，我认为消费者举证难是个技术问题，不是法律问题。就拿食品添加剂来说，对人体有没有害，多大程度、多长时间有害，是每天都吃有害，还是隔天就没害，这个笼统的概念界定首先是技术性问题。此外，赔偿额度也是一个技术性的问题，怎么赔偿？很显然苏丹红不是消费者举证的问题，太强人所难了。
焦点二：经营者应承担何种责任？
正方经典语录：没有钻就不能揽瓷器活。
正方观点（李显冬、王惠娟）：类似苏丹红事件中，经营者应该承担严格的责任。在法律上应该确定一个严格的法律责任，即无过错法律原则，不管是不是有意的，只要把非法添加剂加到食品中，就要承担责任。没有金刚钻，不能揽瓷器活。
反方经典语录：苏丹红事件没有给社会带来严重后果，生产厂家只承担次要责任。
反方观点（郭福良）：苏丹红产品使用没有给社会造成多大严重后果。在有关部门对苏丹红进行评估之后，生产厂家及时停止生产，没有给社会造成严重后果。生产厂家应该承担一定过错责任，但不是主要责任。
焦点三：群体维权事件中亟待解决的是什么？
正方经典语录：在立法上可以借鉴国外一些做法，保护消费者权益。
正方观点（李显冬）：美国曾经有一个药的案子，避孕药被证明多年后会对人体产生损害。因果联系上很难证明究竟是哪一个厂家生产的产品造成今天的结果，但是一个事实是这些厂家在产品中都获利了，也就是说，有对价的东西是公平的，没有对价的东西是不公平的。凡是挣钱的人都应该赔，凡是受到损失的人都有权利要求赔，最后按市场份额理论，如果证明不了销售了多少产品，最少承担一个平均份额。我们在立法上可以借鉴这些制度。
反方经典语录：我们现有的法律体制可以做到，但是现实当中就是不做，关键在这儿。
反方观点（李万华）：最现实的问题是能不能做到，我们现有的法律体制可以做到，但是现实当中就是不做，关键在这儿。比如奥克斯案件，政府监管部门给他生产许可证，出了问题还不去查，要查得话也查不清楚。为什么事件查的清清楚楚，还抓了一些人？对侵害消费者权益的事情，政府注意调查力度，如果想调查的话，哪儿有检查不清楚的呢。
聚焦 ·消费者该如何维权
王惠娟：我提几个具体建议。第一，在消费者索赔诉讼当中，应该适用无过错原则和举证倒置原则。第二，在民法通则的基础上，发展集团诉讼制度，赋予消协或者某个特定的公益组织代表消费者提起诉讼的权利。对于涉及人数众多、涉及人员又不确定，每一个消费者个体所涉及到的诉讼请求又比较小，可以由一个比较典型的消费者提起诉讼。第三，关于精神损害赔偿，应该建立一个最低赔偿制度，要求经营者和生产者同时承担对消费者精神损害的赔偿责任。
李显冬 ：像奥拓汽车苯超标的事件，因为汽车标准是一个空白地带，消费者怎么办呢？在不能找到明确具体规定的情况下，一般侵权办法解决，有三个方面：第一，首先你要证明你有没有损害。第二，如果你受到损害，必须要证明造成这个损害的行为是违法的，如果造成损害的行为是合法的，同样不承担责任。第三，受到损害、有了违法行为，还要证明这两个行为之间有因果联系。
李万华：对一些特殊行业、特殊情况，可以像消协规定的那样，生产方和经营方先交小额赔偿金一万、一千，出了问题先行赔付。
文章来源：竞报 |
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